The D Stands For Defeat

Howard 'The Scream' Dean depicted as the famous 'Sorrow' sculpture by Pierre Jean David d'Anger ca.1811

I was just listening to a podcast with a recording of one of Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean's frenzied speeches, where he is shouting like a man possessed, in an attempt to whip up the crowd into a frenzy. The kind of demagogue speech akin to the darkest period of European 20th Century history. It has been dubbed as 'I have a scream' speech. That was scary, I thought that I was listening to one of the history programs I was so petrified of as a child, featuring the totalitarian rallies we all know so well.

Whilst this particular speech may be old, Howard Dean has displayed identical characteristics far more recently than that. Indeed, his aggression is by no means out of character, nor a part of an isolated incident, and as such will continue to be used as an example, archives or not.

Be that as it may, he does represent the democratic party, and therefore is as such,  a person of the utmost importance to the future of the same, whether he has your vote or not.

Is this man going to take back The White House as he is screaming on the top of his voice he intends to do? Holding the white flag up as the Democratic Party banner. Hopefully not. I thought for a moment I was in Iran listening to the Ayatollah calling out for Jihad.

Just catching up on some news on our would be President and his declarations of defeat....Thank you to my friend @ The Right Nation for the title.

Ed Morrissey's article in The Weekly Standard slam dunks the Dems arguing that they had to reach back 140 years for their War strategy which he calls "Rally Round The White Flag Boys".

"The good news for the Democrats is that their leadership has settled on an electoral strategy for 2006. The bad news is that they have cribbed their game plan from one of the most disastrous campaigns in their history. The Democratic leadership has decided to elevate surrender to a party platform for the upcoming elections, with their national chairman, House leader, and last presidential nominee all running up the white flag as the Democratic war banner.

When was the last time that an entire political party stood for backpedaling the way the Democrats have in the past two weeks? Since Rep. John Murtha made his supposedly stunning announcement that he wanted an immediate withdrawal of all troops from Iraq, the Democrats have embraced surrender.

Not even during the Vietnam War did a major American party position itself to support abject retreat as a wartime political platform. For that, one has to go back to the Civil War, when the Democrats demanded a negotiated peace with the Confederate States of America and a withdrawal from the South.".

The WaPo picks up on it:

"Strong antiwar comments in recent days by House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi and Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean have opened anew a party rift over Iraq, with some lawmakers warning that the leaders' rhetorical blasts could harm efforts to win control of Congress next year.

Several Democrats joined President Bush yesterday in rebuking Dean's declaration to a San Antonio radio station Monday that "the idea that we're going to win the war in Iraq is an idea which is just plain wrong."

The critics said that comment could reinforce popular perceptions that the party is weak on military matters and divert attention from the president's growing political problems on the war and other issues. "Dean's take on Iraq makes even less sense than the scream in Iowa: Both are uninformed and unhelpful," said Rep. Jim Marshall (D-Ga.), recalling Dean's famous election-night roar after stumbling in Iowa during his 2004 presidential bid."

John @ Discriminations:

"It seems to me that it's not clear whether the biggest problem facing the Democrats today is that they don't have a strategy for Iraq, or that they do and they're worried voters will find out what it is."

Jeff Goldstein:

"Well, uh, many Democrats do favor just such a retreat, Mr Emanuel.  Dean, Pelosi, Murtha et al., are just more candid with their rhetoric.

And these aren’t fringe kooks we’re talking about.  This is your party Chairman, your House Minority Leader, and your new go-to “hawk.”

Speaking of which, Cam Edwards has an illuminating piece on Townhall that illustrates—using their own words—how Democratic defeatists like Howard Dean are actually less sanguine about our hopes for victory than are the enemy we are engaging on the battlefield"

Tom Maguire:

"Well, yes - Dem leaders evidently must do something to placate the vocal portion of their party, which is intent on re-fighting the intelligence wars of 2002.  And for the rest of us, some sensible plan to carry us forward from 2005 would be helpful - screaming "We should never have gone in, and I told you not to" is not exactly an exit strategy."

Hugh Hewitt looks at the bright side:

"This story spends an unprecedented 11 grafs talking about progress in Iraq before moving on to looming threats of violence. Read the whole thing. It's really great, and recommended reading for Dean and the rest of the Defeaticrats. When the Post writes a story about Iraqi political operatives that makes them sound more like BC-'04 and Kedwards kids than martyr brigades, it's hard to deny that progress has been made"

And the typical Tom Maguire slam dunk finish:

"I would think the Dems could attempt in 2006 just what John Kerry attempted in 2002 - endorse the broad outline of the Bush plan (Iraqification and withdrawal), then change the subject to domestic issues.  But first they need to help their Chairman and their House Minority Leader recover from their Vietnam flashbacks (with Kerry, it is not a flashback - it's the ongoing feature film)."

MICHELLE MALKIN HAS THE 'RETREAT AND DEFEAT' VIDEO.

UPDATE: A loyal liberal reader of mine has complained in the comments section below:

"So the right wingers are reaching back into the archives to find the "scream speech" from Dean's Primary campaign to use as a propaganda campaign against democrats."

Well Jim, let me just say this. I don't consider myself a right winger. I consider myself a liberal conservative perhaps more in English terms, as a result of my education, but more importantly and above all else I consider myself a well brought up Christian. When I say above all else, I truly mean I am a Christian before being a liberal conservative or anything else for that matter, and that part of my personality transcends all political argument.

The reason why I am telling you all this, is because when I look at someone like Howard Dean, I am not, like perhaps many others, blinded by his political leanings. I look at him as an individual and what he stands for as a person.

I did not reach deep into the archives today to specifically find the man screaming or for that matter was not looking for him to do anything at all. I researched today to see what this man is all about in an attempt to be reasonably fair.

The reason why I have come out on this issue quite strongly, as you say "[You were] much more enthusiastic about the posts on middle ground", is because having sat down with Howard Dean for a few hours today, metaphysically speaking, reviewing what he has said and how he has said it, what he stands for as a person and how he relays that in varying circumstances, I was quite appalled.

Appalled that this aggressive, badly brought up bully, who'd be the first to push past you in the elevator, is being considered as a Presidential candidate. That tells me that manners are out of the window, that screaming aggression is o.k; that tells me that the would be President would set a new precedent for the Democrats. And that is scary.

Can you think of one democratic president in the last 20 years who'd fit that description? Clinton was and is, a charming, polite and very bright individual. I would invite him over to spend time with my family any time. I would talk to him at length at a social occasion. I may not share his political views, but I share his sense as a person. And please, spare me the 'Monica' retort.

In contrast I would avoid a man like Howard Dean, like the plague. If he came over to talk to me at a social occasion I would politely try to finish the conversation as quickly as possible, hating every minute of it. Why? Because as a person, I have zero respect for a shouting aggressive badly brought up bully, who does not belong in the White House or in any public office. He encourages others around him to emulate such behavior, spreading the mantra of bad social behavior like the plague.

Now I haven't even started on the political issues, because at this stage they are completely irrelevant to me. I would not give this man the time of day, and brush him off my lapel like a speck of aggravating dust.

Howard Dean to me lacks the most basic qualities to make him fit for a Presidential candidate, no matter what side of the political spectrum he belongs to, and this is why I have come out against him in such a strong manner; it is before this very canvas that I have 'painted' today's picture, issues et al. 

To reiterate, I would have come out against him whether he was right or left. This is why I hate empty partisan comments, because they are simply based on the fact that he is a democrat, and as such he is OK and to be defended no matter what, accusing me of running a propaganda campaign when I dare mention the fact that the guy sounds like a totalitarian dictator from another era.

Why else do you defend this man, if not for the simple fact that he is a Democrat? Would you have come to his defence if he was a Conservative?

Hugh Hewitt has more.

Check out these great blogs for further on the story: Wizbang, Blogs for Bush, Daily Pundit, California Conservative, Outside The Beltway, Lorie Byrd @  PoliPundit,  Winds of Change, The Right Nation, The Political Teen, and Baldilocks.

UPDATE NOV 9TH: The story goes on ..... Ed Morrissey @ Captain's Quarters has some more , so does The Drudge Report, Lorie Byrd @  PoliPundit, California Conservative  Austin Bay Blog, Blogs for Bush and John Hinderaker @  Power Line who coins the term 'Defeatocrats', originally dubbed by Mark Steyn. Gina Cobb weighs in with her usual candor: "This is the same Howard Dean who predicted on October 2, 2004 that it was very unlikely that there would be democracy in Iraq" Heh.

UPDATE with Further Links. Thank you to The Right Nation :  Austin Bay Blog, Mudville Gazette, Crazy Politico's Rantings, The Ohio Conservative, The Filthy One, The Palmetto Observer, Conservative Outpost, Finding a Balance,, 2nd Battalion 94th Artillery, RadioActive Chief, Evil Conservative, McBride's Media Matters, EckerNet, Kennedy vs. the Machine, A Lady's Ruminations, The Asylum, Euphoric Reality, The Tension, A Soldier's Perspective, Hoaah Wife, The Makaha Surf Report, Lifelike Pundits, The Dumb Ox, Spatula City, Pet Bog, The Colossus, Pundit Guy.

Comments

[MARK PATTERSON]

DEAR ALEXANDRA,your post is D IS FOR DEFEAT,IS IT NOT. here it is alexandra, the news today 12/17/05,I AM LISTENING TO REP. ARLEN SPECTOR CRITISIZING YOUR PRESIDENT FOR BREAKING THE LAW, THE "PATRIOT ACT" IS HELD SUSPECT BY MOST AMERICANS,THIS MY DEAR IS MUCH WORSE THAN DEFEAT,IN IRAQ,THIS IS THE DEFEAT OF OUR AMERICAN RIGHTS,THE BILL OF RIGHTS,WE ARE LOSING OUR FREEDOMS,ANSWER ME ON THIS PLEASE. the congress says bush has broken the law,TO SPY ON AMERICANS,THE FBI AND SECRET COURTS ISSUE '"WARRANTS", this is the homeland security laws,WELL,WELL,bush broke the law did he not. DEFEATIST IS THE WORD MY DEAR. america is sick of fear,illegal aliens here in arizona where i live flood across the border in mass, BUSH CAME HERE LAST MONTH,GAVE A LITTLE SPEECH,AGAIN,NOTHING WILL BE DONE,WHY??? BECAUSE BIG BUSINESS USES THESE PEOPLE RIGHT, AND YOUR PARTY IS THE "BUSINESS,AND LESS SPENDING,LESS GOVT. PARTY" RIGHT. talk about security nightmares,there are thousands pouring across our borders, this "election" will definately start civil war,WHAT THEN,WHEN IF EVER WILL WE LEAVE. sorry lady,but you condemn democrats,DEMOCRATS MY FINE LADY HAVE HAD NO CONTROL IN ANY OF THE FIFTY STATES,RIGHT, HAVE HAD ABSOLUTELY NO CONTROL,NONE IN CONGRESS FOR NEARLY A DECADE,OH I AM WRONG,CONTRACT OF AMERICA WAS 94,IT HAS BEEN OVER A DECADE,and what do we have, THE GREATEST DEBT AND DEFICIT IN 200 YEARS,VIETNAM,HIGHEST RENTS,GAS PRICES,SALES AND PROPERTY TAXES IN HISTORY,AND YOU CALL DEMOCRATS DEFEATIST,WHERE DO YOU GET OFF,"you people have had absolute control of the country for OVER TEN YEARS,RIGHT, SO YOU ARE THE ONES WHO SCREWED UP,AND YOU BLAME LIBERALS AND DEMOCRATS WHO HAVE ABSOLUTELY "NO POWER WHATSOEVER",this is beyond hypocracy,it is pure madness.

[Alexandra]

Mark,

I understand you love this post but there are others you are welcome to move onto. You are discussing things here which are being discussed elsewhere.

I have done an open thread post today 'The Preident's Week From Hell' in order to discuss all the issues mentioned in the Jim Lehrer interview with the President.

Perhaps we'll see you there later.

[MARK PATTERSON]

YOUR "SICK LITTLE MONKEY" IS SPYING ON US.yes, he broke the law,YOUR PRESIDENT,THE ONE YOU VOTED FOR, BROKE THE LAW, WENT OUTSIDE THE LAWS HE HELP CREATE,THE "HOMELAND"SECURITY. YES, YOU NEED THE FBI,AND SPECIAL WARRANTS TO "SPY" ON AMERICANS,IT'S ALL OVER THE NEWS FOLKS,FOX,NBC,ALL REPORTING HOW THIS GUY HAS BROKE THE LAW,HOW OUR FREEDOMS ONCE AGAIN ARE IN JEOPARD,WAS IT WORTH IT GIVING THE WEALTH TAX BREAKS TO LOSE OUR FREEDOMS.unbelievable,and now some "GRANDMA'S" PROTESTING THE WAR ARE GETTING WIRE TAPS,HAVING PHONE CONVERSATIONS TAPED AND TAPPED.EVEN BLOGGERS,YEAH LIKE I FEAR A PRESIDENT AND A PARTY THAT CAN'T EVEN FIND OSAMA BIN LADEN,"REMEMBER HIM".so you bankrupt the country,spy on simple ordinary americans,kill our kids in a new vietnam,AND YOU CALL YOURSELVES THE "FAMILY" VALUES PARTY,SOME EVIL SICK JOKE.YES,SOMEWHERE SOME PRISON HELD SECRET,SOME MAN COULD BE ILLEGALLY DETAINED,SHOCKED WITH ELECTRICITY AND TORTURED WITH YOUR FAMILY VALUES. PEOPLE HERE IN AMERICA CAN BE LABELED "TERRORIST",SENT TO PRISON,NO LAWYER,NO NOTIFICATION TO FAMILY,AND HELD FOR YEARS LIKE THAT GUY IN GERMANY,(I HOPE HE SUES)!!,health care up almost 50% thanks to your party handing over our health care to INSURANCE COMPANIES AND DRUG MANUFACTURERS!!IS THIS THE PARTY OF THE REPUBLICANTS!!yep,suckers watch in the next year for inflation to rise,for the war to escalate (AND IT WILL BECAUSE THE SHIITES WILL GET POWER AND THE SUNNI WILL FIGHT THEM),remember the R IS FOR REPULSIVE

[MARK PATTERSON]

WATCHING THE IRAQI VOTERS YESTERDAY REALLY CHOKED ME UP,i honestly can say that,it made me proud.BUT I STILL SAY, THEY SHOULD PAY FOR THIS WAR,AFTERALL THAT'S WHAT BUSH AND WOLFOWITZ SAID,REMEMBER!!!, here it still is, we are probably going to be killing our guys five TO TEN years from now,why, BECAUSE AS THE SUNNI LEADER SAID 12/14,IF THEY DON'T GET THEIR WAY,'"THE MAJORITY",THEIR WILL BE CIVIL WAR.this is the true horror which unfortunately will probably happen, sunni hate shiite, sunni were ba'thist which number over 300,000, when we invaded iraq,NONE WERE ARRESTED,NONE OF THEIR WEAPONS CONFISCATED,UNBELIEVABLE STUPIDITY,(MIGHT OFFEND THE NRA),WHAT THE HELL WERE THEY THINKING,AND WE WONDER WHY OUR GUYS ARE GETTING BLOWN UP. like invading germany,not arresting top nazi leaders,NOT EVEN TAKING THEIR GUNS FOR GODS SAKE,does this make sense to you republicans,it doesn't to me. HERE IS TRUTH SUCKERS, WE WILL PAY FOR THIS WAR WITH OUR FUTURE,WITH OUR SOCIAL SECURITY, WITH MEDICARE,WITH "CHEAP HOUSING",some for the returning troops. WAKE UP PEOPLE, DISCUSSING "PHILOSOPHY",WHEN AMERICA IS PREPARING FOR RECESSION,WITH A 9 TRILLION DEBT,GO FIGURE, REMEMBER BUSH SR. AND WHAT THEY SAID ABOUT HIS INFLATION PROBLEM, "IT'S THE ECONOMY STUPID",IMAGINE,IMAGINE WHAT AWAITS US,AND THE WAR IS A BILLION A DAY NOW.DID ANY OF YOU SEE PETER JENNINGS LAST REPORT ON 20/20,12/15,he reported on the disaster called health care in america,we UNDER THE REPUBLICANS!!,HAVE TURNED HEALTH CARE OVER TO THE INSURANCE COMPANIES,AND PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES,GREAT,AND YOU WONDER WHY IT'S UP 45%,AND GROWING EVERY DAY,WE PAY THEM,TO LIVE!!

[mark patterson]

i still wonder why we are paying for the iraq war. wasn't it wolfowitz(the architect of the war),and your bush who said, IRAQ WILL PAY FOR THE WAR WITH IT'S OIL RESERVES,WELL,WELL,THE TRILLION(S) DOLLAR CHECKS ARE WAY,WAY OVERDUE.

[mark patterson]

THE UNVEILING HAS OCCURED,AND AMERICA SEES FRAUD,INCOMPETENCE,BANKRUPTCY. sorry folks those CLINTON LEFTIE YEARS were golden,we even HAD A SURPLUS.now sorry to bust your stupid bubble but remember a man named gingrich,remember your CONTRACT ON AMERICA, what did it say, that the "republicants" would BALANCE THE BUDGET,GET RID OF THE DEBT,HEAR ME, THE DEBT,AND CUT GOVERNMENT SPENDING. well, "homeland" is the biggest govt. agency EVER created,and it sure worked in new orleans. the debt is approaching 9 trillion,a billion dollars a day for iraq,and we borrow a billion a day from china alone, 3 million jobs gone, 3 million more within the next decade.HERE IT IS,YOU LIE,YOU ARE IN DENIAL, THIS BUSH HAS BANKRUPTED THE COUNTRY AND YOU DON'T EVEN SEE IT. sure millionaires are workin the stock market, buying up,charging horrific rent, AND YOU PAID FOR THIS, WHILE YOU WILL PAY OFF THE DEBT AND DEFICIT WHICH IS THE HIGHEST IN RECORDED HISTORY,THAT'S TWO HUNDRED YEARS FOLKS.wonder why i'm angry, well so is about 60% of this country,in every poll. what the hell are we winning in the iraq. just today, sunnni leader says that if they don't get what they want,AND THEY WON'T ,THEIR THE MINORITY,they will declare a civil war,boy if that happens,GOOD MORNING VIETNAM.

[D. Ox]

We never cease to be amazed at the negativity from the left. Their only hope for returning to power is via fear-mongering, frankly because socialism failed and all they have left is abortion and gay rights as affirmative policies. Whether they are twisting words from the troops, focusing overwhelmingly on negative stories in Iraq (see Media Research Center's cyberalert) or on the homefront, it's one "-gate" after another. Of course their distortions are all justified because they are in possession of the "truth" and know what's best for us. Nice of one neo-lib anyway to admit that they would exterminate conservatives if given half a chance. Hmm.

Great blog Alexandra!

[jeff stiles]

"Folks this is over six months later,and virtually most of mississippi coast still in total ruins."

And yet, our nation's economy is still roaring, unemployment is at record lows, gas prices are manageable, and Iraq is undergoing its second election this year.

My, life really sucks, doesn't it!

[MARK PATTERSON]

i know one thing for sure,FOR CERTAIN. if the democrats had a majority in congress,there WOULD BE INVESTIGATIONS INTO THE 3 MILLION JOBS LEAVING AMERICA,ON TOP OF THE MILLIONS THAT HAVE OCCURED UNDER BUSH.bush has failed new orleans,and mississippi,EVEN HALEY BARBOUR,THE STANDARD BEARER OF THE REPUBLICANS HAS PETITIONED CONGRESS,PLEADING FOR HELP,folks this is over six months later,and virtually most of mississippi coast still in total ruins.

[jeff stiles]

Sorry Mark (and Alexandra). I was having a very difficult day yesterday.

[patrick]

Mark,

I keep reading the negatives...

What is your plan to change America? If you were Emperor for a year and could make any changes to the law of the land, move government agencies around, disband them, create new ones and your changes would have the might of constitutional amendments so that they would be very hard to change, what would your America look like and how would it interact with the rest of the world?

I believe we are getting a fair picture of what you do not like, however, I have absolutely no idea as to what your america would actually look like, or how it would function. I am not trying to be obtuse, but other than a creating a totalitarian state, I have no idea how to prevent all the things you rail against. Please educate me...

[Alexandra]

Come on Jeff, don't be like that, Mark shouts a little (well actually a lot less now), but we do need, and indeed welcome the opposing point of view here on ATB, you know that.

Anyone who bothers to take the time to explain themselves in this lengthy way (unlike the Atrios rhetorical one liners) deserves not only our ear, but our respect shown by our valid responses, all of which we have done.

[jeff stiles]

I suppose our resident troll, Mark, thinks President Bush is at fault for Katrina hitting New Orleans too. What a frickin' loser . . .

[MARK PATTERSON]

europe is far from perfect,ESPECIALLY NOW WITH THEIR ECONOMIES DEPENDENT ON US AS WELL,THEY ARE HIT HARD,BUT HERE IS SOME GOOD NEWS TO YOU REPUBLICANTS.more jobs moving overseas, 12/12/05 kevin hall "knight rider" wash. here it is, it's no longer just software programming,it is architecture jobs,77%of the top 200 u.s. law firms use contact lawyers ,with 6 percent contracting to lawyers off-shore. THREE MILLION JOBS EXPECTED TO MOVE OFFSHORE OVER NEXT DECADE.and what are your republicans doing about it,hell,THEY'RE MAKIN A FORTUNE,BUISINESS REAPS MEGA PROFITS WITH OUR FUTURE.suckers these republicans will thoroughly bankrupt and ruin the middle class,AND YOU BOUGHT IT, just today,your 'president' said 12/12/05 that EVEN IF HE DIDN'T "KNOW" SADDAM WAS NOT GOING TO ATTACK US,DID NOT HAVE NUCLEAR,CHEMICAL,BIOLOGICAL WEAPONS,HE WOULD STILL HAVE DECLARED WAR.now if this is true,he is truly a moron, murdered 3,000 americans, 125,000 iraqi,permanently wounded 65,000,for life. great guy you voted for,now i think he owes congress a apology,THEY BELIEVED THOSE LIES,AT LEAST THE DEMOCRATS DID,AND THEY WANT THIS DEBACLE OVER BEFORE IT IS VIETNAM.just talked to a vet today at the v.a.,he basically said, what we did was good,but we must get out,it is getting REALLY bad,and the iraqi want us to leave,(probably so they can start killing each other,(sunni versus shiite). so be happy knowing jobs going overseas,scandal over torture,camps,delay,ect.vietnam again,and just thank your lucky stars you don't live in new orleans

[North by Northwest]

YEAH, I read that - good old NHS.

BTW, no need to apologize; fact is that French farmers and members of the transport related workforce at large seem particularly aggressive - is there ever going to be a beginning of "Les Grandes Vacances" without some kind of national strike grid-locking all outbound holiday makers... So, it's been the truth far too often.

"issues of governance and privacy": That's what Europe as a whole -- with the exception of the UK to some extend -- struggles to fully comprehend: How deeply rooted and intact American's need and demand for much more autonomy and self-determination actually is. It's night and day when compared to the Europeans.

[patrick]

NbN,

The inflexible unions are a problem. I remember when the shop owner's union (rough translation) barely defeated a change that would have allowed stores to stay open longer. If one stays open longer, we all have to stay open longer and that just isn't fair. There actually has been a lot of change more recently with a desire for longer hours, etc. so they can be more competative.

Unfortunately for the unions, the world in which we stick together and all live in a worker's paradise usually ends with everyone being unemployed.

Next topic: Health care. Good and bad. Good that everyone gets access, however the quality of the care is not so great and of course the state decides what is provided. Have you read the story of the English Ace who had to sell his medals because his wife would be operated on, but not until a year and a half later?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/12/08/nduke08.xml&sSheet=/news/2005/12/08/ixnewstop.html

The medical is there. Just not always when you need it.

Sorry about the aside on the lunacy of continuous french protests. Others in the EU actually want economic growth and job security. I have been "distracted" today and will be a little more cogent on my posts starting Wednesday. Until then, please accept my apologies in advance of these semi-lucid ramblings and questions. I just like participating with the civilized and thoughtful people.

My departing shot. For all the topics we have discussed and further issues of governance and privacy: Every person has a different idea of where government should start and end. Should the government or I be responsible for my self in my old age? Should the government or I be responsible for my health care? Should the government or I determine how big a car I should drive? Everywhere we let the government make the decisions, realize that large portions of our society will be unhappy with the decisions government makes. Governments do big things for lots of people well. Governments cannot take care of individual concerns well (economies of scale). The government could feed everyone very well. The problem would be that we would only have a few choices for what is on the plate. I myself would rather have Fajitas, Szechuan Beef, or Hummus when I want them with the fixings I like.

[North by Northwest]

Patrick - you certainly know how to keep your calm ;)

Are you sure about your view on German Unions and "socialized medicine"? The way I understand it is, that most Germans blame the Unions with their relentless resistance to wage-cuts and flexible employment terms to have 'driven' out jobs and domestic industrial expansion. In any event, Mark seems to be oblivious to the fact, that China is fast becoming the factory of the world, forcing ALL economies to rethink their business models. This isn't partisan, this is merely economic fact.

Similarly, I thought, that Germany's public health care system is viewed by most as a major problem and very much feared as a long-term fiscal burden due to implode in the next 15-25 years due increasing longevity and reducing birthrates, meaning, more ailing patients for longer periods of time coupled with concurrently dwindling tax revenues to pay for it all, due to a continuously shrinking workforce.

But the public health care system is for too many their holy cow - political suicide who ever touches it. Who knows, maybe Merkel with her hardnosed East German no-nonsense style might actually push through some overdue reforms. Could be a new Iron Lady in the making over there.

[patrick]

Mark,

I just realized how unclear my previous post was. I must disagree with your version of Europe. This is from someone who lived there for a few years, not just hit the tourist sites for 1 week here, and 1 week there. Before you attack, yes, I do speak German and I lived in Weinheim-Sulzbach (on the Weinstrasse near Heidelberg where my daughter was born).

I have also lived in the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan for several months also. In both countries I have been in numerous peoples homes and met their families and talked of common dreams and aspirations. We do see the world differently sometimes, but there is so much that we all have in common. I have had tea with truck drivers and Bedouins in the desert with no government around them. I have been in very exclusive playgrounds also. I hope you have talked to more than just one segment of a population to find out who they are.

What is YOUR opinion and how did you gain it?

[patrick]

Such hate and impotence...How do you face every day? I hope when you speak of visiting Germany 10 times, I trust you spent some time there. I lived there for a few years and I must agree with most of the comments about unions and socialized medicine.

Please define "workers" I would like to know who they are. Are they the workers in France who strike so often, I never made it to Paris itself because everyone gets their day to shut down the highways to protest cheap import this or that, or demanding a 30 hour work week as the 35 hour work week was much to stressful...

I trust you have also lived in the middle east, or are you only regurgitating someone else's opinion since you appear to have none of your own.

Sorry, that was inappropriate since personal attacks are only used when you can't refute an argument. I am just waiting to hear an argument from you. Until then, try not to put yourself into the hospital with your self-loathing that you direct at others.

[MARK PATTERSON]

to the idiot above commenting on "unions" ruining german workers,crap to you i say, i have been to europe nearly 10 times,they talk, they had it good,the unions didn't do this fool,this is another crappy republican lie, unions protected germans,till they did what we did,SENT OUR JOBS TO MEXICO,CHINA,ECT. TO SCREW THE WORKERS AND MAKE MILLIONAIRES OUT OF CEO'S. sucker. and can anyone answer this question.IF THE CONGRESS NOW,KNEW WHAT IT KNOWS NOW "WEAPONS OF NUCLEAR,CHEMICAL,BIOLOGICAL MASS DESTRUCTION,THAT SADDAM WAS EMINENTLY GOING TO ATTACK US, EMINENT THREAT, "MUSHROOM CLOUD",IF CONGRESS KNEW ALL THIS TO BE UNTRUE,WOULD THEY HAVE VOTED TO INVADE IRAQ,WOULD THEY,I THINK NOT.AND FOR YOU SUCKERS THAT SAY I AM WRONG, I HAVE HEARD YOUR REPUBLICANS THEMSELVES SAY THEY WOULD NOT HAVE VOTED FOR A INVASION.now suckers believe in your liar murderer,but if we don't leave soon,it will be vietnam,or worse,i don't remember anyone from n. vietnamn blowing themselves up,DO YOU.I ALSO KNOW CANADIANS AND GERMANS,THEY HAVE "RAVED" ABOUT THEIR HEALTH CARE,SO YOU SIR ARE WRONG AS WELL AS GULLABLE,probably got your information from rush limburger,he's so poor you know, only 40 million a year,and on all that oxycontin,THE BUM SHOULD BE IN JAIL FOR ILLEGAL DRUG ABUSE.

[Alexandra]

Screejay,

Thank you for that, you should weigh in on the open thread today on this subject. Everyone is interested to have feedback on it!

[spiritofecstasy]

John Gamash,

Thank You Sir, you just made my day and probably my whole week. Succinct comments, nice targetting -points, outstanding attitude! I really enjoy that!

Contrary to appearences there are Many of Us in America who refuse to fall prey. Refuse to be led by exaggerated journals, publications and media "topics with predictable styles and pov." The constant contradiction won't get past the front door or the remote control buttons of plenty of Us.

Americans. Americans of European descent. Americans of African descent. Americans of Asian descent et al, et al, et al.

Many of Us know the games as You obviously do!

[Screejay]

Alexandra
I had to dig a little but I found a book that addresses your questions of the media and how the troops view it. It's called "America's Team, the odd couple. A report on the relationship between the media and the military" by Frank Aukofer (Milwaukee Journal Sentinel) and William P, Lawrence (Vice Admiral, U.S. Navy, Retired). In the forward it states "At least since Vietnam, and as late as Desert Storm, the relationship has been sometimes stormy, again strained and often surly, There have been charges of bad faith on both sides. At its worst, the rhetoric included charges on one side that the military lies, manipulates and misleads and on the other that the press is biased, unfair and unpatriotic. Certainly soldiers, sailors and Marines have a First Amendment right to condone the work of journalists. Certainly journalists have a First Amendment right to critize the military's censorship." Today those words still ring true; we view the press in an adversarial relationship. As such, most in the military do not trust the media. Take the BBC for example. They will not refer to the British troops deployed in Basra as "Our troops". They have stated that since they have a worldwide viewer ship, the term "Our" might seem offensive to some. Instead they use the term “UK soldiers”. My friends in the RAF find this very offensive, rightfully so. How would you feel being interviewed by the press when they are not even able to acknowledge the bond citizenship? Hostile I'd guess.

[Alexandra]

John,

Since you are a) awake and b) weighing in from the Middle East where the action is, would you like to start a comment in the new Sunday open thread I just posted. Yours will be just the topics I would love to be discussed by the readers...
If your friends would like to join in they are welcome. I am sure there are plenty of things that make them angry when they read the press back home.

[John Gamash]

By the way, RE: yesterday's post.. answer for Alexandra.. for those troops actually paying attention to the media, most are pretty savvy and understand what's going on I think. Most of us are too busy to get caught up in it anyway. I don't think it really hits most folks until they get back to the states and realize, "hey, that's not what I saw!" It's really NOT just death and destruction here. The good things happening far outweigh the bad.

[John Gamash]

Hmm... I'm new to this post. But it seems Mark the screamer answered his own question about Mercedes Benz workers... and I quote.."30 dollars a Hour, Paid Health Care (sic), paid cost of living adjustments, paid housing subsidies, monthly (sic) vacations,.." This is undeniably a world market now. To be isolationist is suicide. A logical outgrowth competition? Cutting costs! It's happening all over. Unrealistically high costs imposed by unions are strangling competition in both the US and Europe. Hence, outsourcing. Europe also suffers from high taxation and socialism. The only reason they have any economic growth at all is they have waken up to tax cuts, too. The eastern European countries have discovered flat taxes and their economies have taken off! Same in China and India. We're going to have to reform our system- flat tax, national sales tax (my preference) or see alot of opportunity pass us by.
By the way, ask the average Brit or German what they think of socialized medicine. It'll open your eyes. Hell, I'll bet even the average Canadian can wow you with horror stories by now. With Mark's liberals in power? Socialized medicine is coming... 17% of the economy will be socialized.. research and development, innovation all strangled.
National Debt? Yeah, he's right. Can't go on forever. But payments as a percentage of GDP? Still manageable. Thank goodness for 4% growth.
Gasoline prices? yawn.. they're high. No doubt about it. Supply is still good however. Prices flucuate on a world market. A benefit of high prices? It will spur innovation into other forms of energy as people continue to demand alternatives. Are the oil companies colluding? I doubt it. Besides, when did it become illegal to make a profit for taking entrepreneurial risk?
I love these liberal posters. They become a parody of themselves. But don't cut him off. They are very instructive.

Cheers from the desert of the middle east.

[jess1dering]

I see so many news stories that are crafted to support a certain view ( almost always Left, anti-war, you know the list..) What you write makes sense. Sometimes though it seems less 'innocent' than that.The case that comes to mind at the moment is dear Jeffrey Starr's last letter home. Are you familiar with that story ? It was the letter of a patriot and it was edited and used to represent a view in opposition to what that soldiers intententions were when he penned it. That soldier, who had given his life for his country and had stated in his letter that he was willing to do so, was deliberately misrepresented to sway opinion against the war. The enormity of that one betrayal is staggering to my mind ( and soul ) . Is it possible that they are so conditioned that they don't SEE it? I just don't understand how that could be possible. I've been wondering, the media has proven to be such an incredibly powerful force , why aren't journalists being educated in areas such as professional ethics and standards ,straight reporting ( eg. how to eliminate personal opinion from reporting and present FACTS )? I believe that it is possible to report objectively, but that it requires working for your money. WOULD it be possible for regulations of some sort to influence how ,and what ,institutions of "higher" learning taught their journalists. I don't mean restriction, rather requirement.

[antimedia]

Stefan, there's a great deal of truth in that. Just like Kos and Atrios can't even see the bias of the media, the media can't see it either. I also think it's a big problem that the media "schmoozes" with the politicians and leaders. They say they have to do it to build their network of sources, but in the end it forces them to ignore things they shouldn't ignore, gloss over things they shouldn't gloss over and take the word of people they should be very suspicious of.

[Stefan]

Well Jess,
If you are suggesting that the media is biased against GWB I don’t really see how any fair minded person could disagree. I don’t know if you read Bernard Goldberg’s “Bias” but he makes some very interesting comments. It is not, in his experience, that it is a big conspiracy but rather that most reporters and newsmen are cut from the same cloth. They have similar backgrounds, go to the same journalism schools, learn from the same professors, hang out together, most are deeply secular, they (similar to those in the salons of western Europe whom they greatly admire) no longer believe in anything. They feel that the West has failed and they have discarded the spiritual heritage (which is firmly rooted in Christianity) as outmoded. When Bush says that all people are meant to live in freedom because it is the gift of the Almighty they short-circuit because they don’t believe it. In a nutshell they have essentially the same world view. The UN and the EU look like the future to them. National pride seems akin to xenophobia to the Secular Internationalist. There have been many surveys of political leanings and presidential votes of those working in the major news outlets and they are overwhelmingly tilted to the left. They think they are giving conservatives a fair shake but that conservatives are just wrong. It is as simple as that. The mask really comes off when the stakes are really high though. At the most heat time just prior to the election they just started making stuff up as their passion just made them forget they have to be “impartial”. The mask is off now with Iraq. Now the media folks are also star worshippers and ass-kissers (forgive my language) and if Bush’s numbers are way, way up they will back off and even do some band wagon jumping but if he looks weak at all they will circle overhead. They also love to bring people down. Even if there is a liberal who is clearly dead meat they will pick at the carcass. Remember after the first Iraqi election turned out peaceful? They were all like: “Oh crap what do we do?” They were not sure if they needed to jump on the Iraq is working bandwagon or not. “Jeez, Maybe Bush was right”. This only lasted ‘till there was some more violence and then they were spinning it into the “despite the election Iraq is falling in to chaos” bit. They are fickle and weak-minded. A few thoughts there I guess.

[jess1dering]

OR since nary a one is really in the mood or the spirit to chat about THAT , I'll work the topic in at a later date :)

[jess1dering]

Let me ask it this way, if President Bush had given Howard Dean's scream speech, wouldn't most Americans know it word for word, gesture for gesture by now : This being due to constant exposure?

[jess1dering]

So Stefan, Kenny, ........ what about the media, any thoughts?

[Stefan]

If you see ALL CAPITALS just scroll on by..nothing to see here folks.

[jess1dering]

Hi there, Kenny !

[Kenny Pierce]

How long do you guys plan to feed the troll?

[MARK PATTERSON]

"TO THE ABOVE,DO YOU KNOW WHY EUROPE IS HAVING GREAT ECONOMIC TROUBLE NOW,JUST GUESS SUCKERS,mercedes benz worker in munich 15 years ago made nearly 30 DOLLARS A HOUR,PAID HEALTH CAR,PAID COST OF LIVING ADJUSTMENTS,PAID(HOUSING SUBSIDIES),MONTLY VACATIONS,what happened, they started shipping their jobs OVERSEAS LIKE YOUR REPUBLICAN HACKS DO, WAGES WENT DOW, THE REST IS HISTORY,GREED KNOWS NO BOUNDS,AND YOU ELECTED THEM!!! YOUR EDUCATION IN EUROPE IS "[PAID FOR),HOW MANY STUDENTS ARE NOW SPENDING NEARLY 100,000 IN LOANS ,HOW LONG MUST THEY WORK TO PAY THIS CRAP OFF. health care,I'LL SAY IT AGAIN,I DON'T SEE THE DANISH,THE SWEDES,THE GERMANS RISKING EVERYTHING TO CROSS OUR BORDERS TO GET OUR "HEALTH CARE",WELL,DO YOU!!! everything goes to iraq, where is the billions of dollars the "son of a bush" promised in alternative fuels,where. remember hydrogen,he spoke a hour about that,i do watch him,but it is hard,such a embarassment to hear him TALK. HERE IS YOUR FUTURE SILLY REPUBLICANS, YOU WILL HAVE NO PENSIONS, VERIZON,SEARS,CIRCUIT CITY,REAPING BILLIONS,BILLIONS IN PROFITS,CEO'S AMASSING MILLIONS,BUT YOU,YOUR JOB,YOUR YEARS OF SACRIFICE, SUCKERS IT WILL BE GONE,AND THIS WOULD NEVER,EVER HAVE HAPPENED WITH DEMOCRATS IN POWER,WITH LIBERALS IN POWER, ALL FOR THE DOLLAR YOUR PARTY OF GREED,THE REPUBLICANS. yes repiglians you have shown europe how to screw their labor,unions,ect. and they are suffering, and it is because OUR DOLLAR ALSO IS SO DAMN WEAK, THAT IS WHY THINGS ARE SO EXPENSIVE IN EUROPE,I KNOW I TRAVELED THERE OVER 9 TIMES. used to be a 30$ meal in berlin was 10$ our money,guess again,under the son of a bush a 10$ meal is now 60$,THIS IS BECAUSE OUR DOLLAR IS NOT STRONG,AND EUROPE SUFFERS AS WELL. HERE IS THE FUTURE AND EAT CROW, THE ECONOMY WILL FESTER WITH INFLATION, 9 TRILLION DEBT,6 TRILLION DEFICIT WILL EXPLODE IN OUR FACES,NO HEALTH CARE,UNDER BUSH ALONE UP 40%,WHEN THE SUCKER LEAVES,MAYBE 10 OR 15%,HEY,THEY VOTED HIM IN HE ISN'T GOING TO STOP "THEM" MAKING MONEY. GAS PRICES,RENT,BASIC EXPENSES WILL INCREASE EVERY SINGLE YEAR, EXXON AFTER MAKING ITS HISTORIC 200 YEAR RECORD PROFITS WILL SCREW YOU AS WELL, OH AND I GUESS CHINA AND INDIA JUST QUIT DRIVING CARS,ECT. SO OUR PRICES WENT DOWN 60CENTS RECENTLY. YES,SOME IDIOT REPUBLICAN SAID IT WAS "CHINA AND INDIA" THAT CREATED THE RECORD GAS PRICES, YEAH RIGHT, EXXON SURE MADE OUT LIKE A BANDIT,AND YOU BOUGHT IT,
SS

[Stefan]

That is per capita (of course)

[Stefan]

Yea, the GDP of Germany (100)is about the same as Arkansas (99). Ouch!!! http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=110005242

[jess1dering]

I am absolutely confounder by the media. The "if it bleeds , it leads " explanation doesn't satisfy the question for me. The question being, what on earth..... are they doing and why ??????

[jess1dering]

Hey antimedia, about the media....?

[antimedia]

Mark, if you believe Europe is doing well then you've been deceived. They may look pretty on the outside, but their socialist systems are crumbling around them. The evidence is readily available. You just don't want to see it. But I doubt anyone who is serious is going to waste time responding to your rantings. You're not interested in debate. You're only interested in screaming. You need help. Take a vacation. Or better yet, move to Europe.

[jess1dering]

Stefan, Your thoughts are so well reasoned and ring true with me. RE: unemployment, medical emergency, single parents? : in the 'governmental charity' equation, another factor is the fraud that people are so willing to committ to take free handouts. It's a system that impairs those who it professes to help....some think that's by conscious design.

[Stefan]

OK pal...whatever you say..

[MARK PATTERSON]

WHAT STEPHAN AND OTHER FAIL TO SEE,AND I AM SURE HE IS IN THE TOP 1%,IS THIS,most businesses nearly 60% do not pay taxes,the wealthy citizens can DONATE money to various causes,WE CANNOT DO THAT CAN WE,THEY "SKIP" THE BIG TAXES YOU SPEAK ABOUT. CHURCH AS WELL OWNS MILLIONS OF ACRES OF LAND,BUSINESS AS WELL, AND THEY SKIP OUT,THIS IS WRONG.how many corporations have businesses on islands like st.croix,curacao,and SKIP TAXES,CAN YOU AND I DO THIS,I THINK NOT. I do not want to discuss the tax situation,but i do know some very wealthy individuals here in phx. AND THEY GET LAWYERS TO SKIP OUT,THEY DO THIS,WAKE UP. WHY DO YOU MIDDLE CLASS PEOPLE PAY WHAT YOU DO AND DEFEND THE RICH SKIPPING OUT, THIS IS LIKE THE MIDDLE AGES,WHERE THE '"KING' GOT EVERYTHING AND YOU LIKE IT!! now today 12/10/05 poland and europe don't buy condolezza,she is lying and they know,THEY OUTTA,IT HAPPENED THERE AS WELL, now poland,our allies russia ARE DEMANDING TO FIND OUT ABOUT THESE '"TORTURE CHAMBERS",can you ever,ever remember a time when america looked so bad,we make nazi germany look rather cool now,so history will not only remember bush as a liar,a murderer,but as a torturer as well. "SOCIALISM IS A FAILED POLICY" writes this "antimedia" clown, yep,YEP,I SURE HEAR ALLOT ABOUT THEM SWEDES,NORWEGIANS,GERMANS,FRENCH,ENGLISH CRASHING THROUGH OUR MEXICAN AND CANADIAN BORDERS TO GET OUR "HEALTH CARE",SUCKER i have been in europe MANY,MANY TIMES, they basically live very well,they do pay allot in taxes,BUT THEY DON'T GET THEIR PENSIONS RIPPED OUT FROM UNDER THEM, SEE:VERIZON,SEARS,ABBOTT LABS,ECT. THEY GET PAID HEALTH CARE AND THEY GET EDUCATION PAID FOR,ECT.this "socialism doesn't work",is pure republican crap,WHY ISN'T EUROPE TRYING TO ENTER THIS COUNTRY LIKE THE MEXICANS,THE S.AMERICANS, IF THINGS ARE SO BAD IN THEIR "SOCIALISTIC" COUNTRIES. we have sold this country out to china,bush borrows a billion dollars,A BILLION A DAY FROM THESE EVIL,TORTURING OGRES WHO ALSO HAVE MURDERED MORE THAN 300 MILLION IN LESS THAN 50 YEARS,LETS ATTACK THEM,AND GIVE THEM DEMOCRACY,REMEMBER TIENENMEN SQUARE,I THINK THIS AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN IS IT. WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN PEOPLE WHEN THAT 9 TRILLION DEBT,THAT 6 TRILLION DEFICIT HIT HOME,yes millionaires with their big tax cuts are spending like mad,but middle america,i think not. yes, the greatest debt in 200 years,bush is historic for never,EVER,vetoing a single spending bill. bill clinton who you hate vetoed 180 REPUBLICAN SPENDING BILLS,BALANCED THE BUDGET,STOPPED GENOCIDE IN YUGOSLAVIA,AND LEFT US WITH A SURPLUS,HEAR ME A SURPLUS,GET READY FOR RECORD INFLATION PEOPLE. the mantra against george sr. was "it's the economy stupid",well,WELL, WAIT TILL THE 8 TRILLION HITS,IT WAS ONLY 2 TRILLION UNDER BUSH SR.!! the democrats again,scattered and stupid should support murtha, we cannot "win" this war, the shiites and sunni will fight long after we leave,AND INSTAL A MUSLIM THEOCRACY,SOME "DEMOCRACY",JUST WAIT,IT WILL HAPPEN. democrats were lied to as well,but they must ADMIT they were lied to,demand those who lied all these years be put on trial for treason,so no more wars like this,ever,ever happen. THE REPUBLICANS ARE VENOMOUS,THEY KNOW THEY WERE LIED TO, REFUSE TO FIND THOSE WHO LIED,AND CONTINUE "STAY THE COURSE",murtha threw a bomb in congress,it blew up in the republicans faces,but the stupid democrats like lieberman "follow along",as "wannabee's" for whatever reason i do not know. CINDY SHEEHAN IS RIGHT, THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HILLARY AND MCCAIN,THEY BOTH SUPPORT THIS LIE OF A WAR,AND ITS MURDERED SOLDIERS!AND REMEMBER THE "CONTRACT OF AMERICA",IT STATED IT WOULD "CUT GOVERNMENT SPENDING,BALANCE THE BUDGET,ELIMINATE THE DEBT',YEAH,THEY SURE FOOLED YOU SUCKERS,HOPE YOU DON'T WORK FOR A MAJOR AIRLINE OR VERIZON.

[Stefan]

I know that many liberals find it disgusting that some people in the USA make obscene amounts of money and others struggle from day to day and this is not a bad sentiment. This is the thing though: as long as people make their money legally it is their money fair and square…sorry…I mean I wish I made more but I don’t because of the path that I chose to take and the circumstances that life brought me…that is my problem and I won’t cry about it. We are a very rich country and it is appropriate and vital that we have a safety net for those who are really in trouble because of tragedy (unemployment, medical emergency, or single parents) but must be designed for catching people who are falling, preventing them from becoming destitute, and then getting them up on their feet again. A trapeze artist is saved from death by the net but they then get back in the act. Liberals fail to understand something very, very important. They make the same error that socialist do. Freedom and equality are not one and the same. They are often diametrically opposed. Some people are smarter, stronger, more creative, better educated, better looking, healthier, and some are born with a leg up because of the hard work and sacrifice of their parents and grandparents. We are not equal from the start. The only way to impose equality is to restrict the ability of some people to rise to whatever level their talents and creativity will take them. This means holding them down; i.e. restricting their freedom. This is what socialism does. If you work hard and make a bunch of money the government takes it and gives it to those who do not feel like getting out of bed. How long will it take till our most dynamic individuals decide that all their hard work gets them no reward and stop busting their asses. This would devastate our economy. A high tide raises all boats and a low tide runs them all aground. Equality under the law is a different matter and we should prevent the greedy and unscrupulous from exploiting those that work hard and live check to check (Enron is a good example) but wealthy does not equal evil. The problem is again (it always comes back to this doesn’t it) that those gifts that God gives us can be used for good or evil. High intellect and creativity can be used to tremendously generous ends or it can be used to destroy our fellow man. That is what free will is all about: The Choice. We are a free nation but we have agreed upon basic rules on which choices will be encouraged and which will be punished. Legal does not equal Just but human society (including the most advanced of us) will always be a work in progress. No matter how advanced we become we will always come back to the most ancient question: “Am I my brother’s keeper?”

[patrick]

Just something that I feel needs to be stated. As a leader in this nation, one must not only act appropriately, but one must also always avoid personal entanglements that could be misconstrued. Regardless of whether the official is guilty or innocent, they forgot the most basic rules about perception. For leaders, the perception of who they are is often more important than the reality. When they have lost the image war, they have lost their power.

I do not mean to denigrate the old adage about character and reputation and which is truly more important; however, if you seek power, you must understand how much of that effectiveness of the position is tied to the individual's reputation. There is a discipline required to maintain that reputation.

I always believe that the character of a person is more important than the reputation. I also would never seek elected office. The rules of the game they play and the reality they must live in.

[jess1dering]

Hello Alexandra. I vote every day :) Wish I could vote two or three times a day... Wonderful discussion , as usual. The Democrats bad behavior was so nicely covered , the only thing I would have added to Patricks observations, AntiMedia did for me. Their unwillingness to yield to the victors ( to phrase it crudely ) , I find terribly disconcerting. Every time I hear or see their persistent efforts to usurp this gov.'t I feel uncomfortable like I feel uncomfortable around very bad manners. Just plain hard to watch ( hear, read etc. ) I suppose bad morals and bad manners are linked at some level. Which brings me to all of the Rebublican indictments. I don't object to them , even though they are so obviously politically motivated. However, I do wonder why on earth the Republicans don't retaliate with endictments of their own ?? Heaven knows there's ample evidence. Then maybe with enough dual-partisan indictments , those guys would clean up their own act a bit. Oh and I'll be back, because what the press does to a story is deeply confounding to me.

[jess1dering]

Mark, I lost A partial post to ether-net! Life can be real hard sometimes. When my son John was a child he had extreme asthma. I couldn't keep a job with insurance because I was always getting called to come pick him up at the day-care due to his illness. I started cleaning offices and houses seven days a week, taking him with me when he was sick or just wanted to be with me ( some days he preferred the company of other youngsters). I couldn't afford health insurance because just "todays" medical / medicine bills were almost MORE than I could stay abreast of. John's dad had left for an OLDER woman, I can laugh at that now ! Anyway those years were gruelingly hard sometimes. But always I was so grateful to have my little boy to love and care for AND I always knew that in comparison to many people on earth , we had it great. Yes, many nights I passed out at night still in my work clothes from exhaustion, we NEVER wore new clothes, always hand me downs. I had to stretch a dollar into three. However, I had dinner for my boy every night and read him a story and tucked him into a safe, warm bed. Even though it was a strain he did recieve the necessary medical care. Christmases could be sparse, but it REALLY is about love. I am just saying that the poorest of us don't have it so bad. Johnny and I were very poor ( materially ). As a believer I had a Source to comfort and strengthen and guide me. He never let me down. Some of the stories I could tell you about raising Johnny, you wouldn't be able to believe. God proved himself so very faithful. There is always a list of things to be grateful for, at least as long as the list of things to gripe about. I encourage you not to take on everybody's problems. We weren't meant to bear everybody else's every problem. There will always be problems and challenges. Met well, by the individual who owns them, they can transform a life for the better, they can build character, they can end in all manner of blessing(s). That's been my experience.. As I see it, your outrage seems to suggest a compassionate heart.: A heart that doesn't want to see people having to suffer. If I am correct then God gave you that heart for a reason. All any of us can do is what is before us to do. I wish you well.

[antimedia]

Kenny, I can attest to that. I get interviewed fairly routinely because I'm a computer security professional. Recently a local TV show interviewed me for one half hour. Two sentences made the final cut. I tried very hard to get the reporter to understand that the story he was working on was not about a security flaw in a software package but about the ignorance of the public in not realizing they have to set up the software correctly. I'll let you guess which story got told. (Hint: the two sentences they used appeared to support the former view.)

I usually do interviews in email. That way I can say, You can quote me thus - "blah, blah, blah". That way, I control what they use. Either that or I do the story on background.

Alexandra, with regard to Kos and Atrios you asked

I am trying to figure out whether they both really believe that or whether these things are said purely for effect? Obviously, besides the obligatory ad hominem, which simply fills the empty gaps, there must be something else there that I am missing.

They sincerely believe what they are saying, all evidence to the contrary notwithstanding.

MARK - I FELT THE SAME WAY YOU DO WHEN CLINTON WAS PRESIDENT!!!!! SOMEHOW THE COUNTRY SURVIVED.

One of the most difficult things to learn in a republican democracy is that you don't always win the elections and you're often "stuck" with leaders whose philosophies are diametrically opposed to yours. Those are the times when your patriotism and belief in your country's system of government are most directly challenged. If you can't accept the fact that you've lost the election and you're not going to get your way, then all sorts of problems can occur. Sometimes it's better to go back to living life and "drop out" of politics for a while than to allow it to consume you.

Jim R writes

The democrats will probably do well in this election, because of the corruption of the right. It seems as if the American people are sick and tired of the reactionaries hijacking of this country. corruption, bad fiscal policy, bad decisions in Iraq, the complete inability to fess up to bad decisions, the list goes on. Latest poll numbers indicate that over 60 percent say America is on the wrong track.

There is so much wrong with this it's difficult to know where to begin.

• Corruption exists in both parties equally. It is wrong regardless of who is involved. If you blame a party, you lose sight of the important fact that corruption is bad for all of us and all of us should be trying to root it out, regardless of party affiliation
• Bad fiscal policy is a matter of opinion. The economy is booming, tax receipts are the highest ever, unemployment is low, interest rates are low - the "bad" fiscal policies are apparently working
• bad decisions in Iraq - those are best left to history. The foreshortened view we have now necessarily ignores many facts that will only be known later
• inability to "fess up" - this is a canard, nothing more. The evidence is that the administration changed tactics in Iraq, adapting to a fluid situation. This is a priori proof of a willingness to admit error and correct it.
• Latest poll numbers are meaningless. Only elections matter. No one knows how 2006 will turn out - it's far too early to tell. Anyone who tells you differently is kidding themselves.

Socialism is, and always has been, a failed policy. To think it would work in America when it has worked nowhere else is folly. When you kill the goose that lays the golden eggs, there will be no more eggs. What then will you do to have your precious government-mandated and government-funded programs? Just look around you, objectively, and ask yourself if you would prefer the 1.6% growth of socialized Europe or the 4.1% growth of American free enterprise. Keep in mind that that growth funds your children's futures, not yours. Yours is already secured.

[Kenny Pierce]

Patrick,

Whatever makes you think Mark has the slightest interest in persuasion? Condemnation is much more fun, and requires much less work and intelligence.

Trollin', trollin', trollin', keep them comments trollin'...

Now, about the media: my perspective on the media changed pretty significantly when I started getting interviewed on TV because of our work with orphans. The reporters were not hostile; in fact they greatly admired what we were doing and sincerely wanted to help. They weren't really doing news pieces; they were doing human interest, practically support-raising stories. And they managed to make me misquote myself -- it was the damnedest thing I ever saw. I mean, there was one televised interview where, simply by playing a clip that left out half my sentence, they made me sound like a complete moron -- and they were trying to make me look good. But the trouble was, they don't know anything at all about the subject matter, and they always have to edit the thing down to fit a time slot or column inches, and since they don't know anything about the subject they don't know what's important and what isn't. So they would cut out things that they didn't think mattered -- and in the process they would completely change the meaning of what I had said.

Since I don't want to comment on politics during Advent I will leave it to you guys to establish what sort of reliability can be obtained from a news media that has little or no military experience, and I will let you guys establish the degree to which the media wants to make the President and military look good.