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Monday, March 13, 2006

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Comments

Mani

I never understand why US President is called "Leader of the Free World". Indian Prime Minister is the leader of free country with a billion population. How does it make US President, Leader of free world. US is not the only country who has freedom.

Nathan

I don't know if you can call early England a democracy just because it had a parlament, so does Iran but we don't consider it a democracy. I think what they meant is that America has the oldest democracy still in existance (democracyin the modern sense of the word, i.e. in which the parlament and leader of the nation are both elected).

DavidByron

I think Canada has a larger area than the US though......

What do we know about India? Most of my knowledge of history and geography comes from board games. There's a nice one that features all the various groups and nations that fought over India over the last thousand years or so. My impression is that large parts of India have nothing whatsoever in common with other large parts of India.

The CIA factbook says India has 16 official languages and only 30% of the country speak the most common one. I've also heard that India has more wars going on within it than any other country. Lots of little independence movements. No doubt most are gnat bites on the behemoth, but it makes me wonder how stable the place really is.

Compare it to the old USSR for example. An empire of huge area and many different peoples speaking different languages, having different histories, cultures and religions. How do you hold together a country that big (both in size and population)? It's an interesting general question I think.

Well in the case of the USSR it just didn't hold together. But if the economy had worked better how long could it have gone on?

In the case of India the rulers of the empire just quit one day leaving a "democracy" that somehow manages to work.

In the case of America the original population along with it's divergent languages histories and cultures was exterminated and replaced by new people who all spoke the same language, had the same religion and adopted the same culture and history.

In Europe the different groups constantly warred with each other until they got to the point where war meant killing tens of millions of people. After that they decided economic integration was the key to political peace and "unified" economically regardless of all the differences in language and culture.

I would say the European system is the best model for divergent groups coming together. Economic unions are being considered in other parts of the world now. South America, the Gulf region and East Asia.

India seems like a shotgun marriage.... a colonial empire with it's head cut off...... it feels like it shouldn't work, but there it is I suppose.

DavidByron

Your version makes more sense ;)

While I was googling around apparently New Zealand is claiming to be the oldest democracy because it gave women the vote first (although I think it was Finland who gave women both the vote and the right to stand for office first) and for some reason I can't figure out some claim the Iroquois confederacy deserve the title of oldest "participatory" democracy.

Apparently Colin Powell claimed the US was the oldest democracy in his now infamous speech about Iraqi WMDs before the UN.

Obviously I'm biased but I think Iceland must lose the title to Britain on the technicality that it was not independent from Denmark until recently. Same goes for the Iroquois and the Isle of Man. The problem with claims based on universality of suffrage -- or other improvements in democracy -- is that democracy is still being improved. It wasn't that long ago that the age for voting was generally reduced to 18, and Britain is considering lowering it to 16. If it does so it won't suddenly become the only democracy in the world.

Alexandra
Mention that it's a partnership between the world's oldest and the world's largest democracies

India is 'affectionately' called the world's oldest democracy simply because it is impressive given it's location, and the US is the world's largest.

DavidByron

The Non-Aligned countries have generally been against America's wars. India was against the Kosovo war too, I believe.

By the way -- why is America refered to as "the oldest Democracy" when it --- well, isn't? I mean Britain was a democracy at the time and self-evidently older. Iceland has had a parliament for about 1000 years although it might not have counted as a separate country from Denmark until recently. The Isle of Man holds the record for the longest continuously operating parliament. And of course the city state of Athens holds the record of being the first democracy. in what sense is the USA the "oldest" democracy?

I've seen many people use this phrase before and I am wondering where it comes from.

pram

The Iraq war is even more unpopular in India than it is here. And in the end, America gains cheap oil, and gets to trumpet how it is the liberator of the world. Aside from body bags, what's in it for India? And for the land of Gandhi to involve itself in a war without purpose would be the ultimate travesty. I didn't agree with a lot of things that the BJP government stood for, but on this one stand they have my complete admiration and respect.

Huan

India is meant to counter China, not Iran. thus there is time to build this relationship.
Iran would be best countered by either Iraq (way too early to function as such) or Turkey (who is being lost to fundamentalism).

what we want cannot be had quickly and there are never enough time, especially in crisis.
long term relationships take time. one night stands are easy to come by but usually part ways the morning after.

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